Kevin Paulk Interview

[GTF]

Often, the hidden agenda is considered to work in the reverse direction, with shoe companies suspected of "paying off" for favorable articles (possibly through advertising). I'm curious about the idea of a hidden agenda for discussing the idea of shoes being overrated.

Right, this is why the article in question is so interesting.  It is rare to find anyone willing to speak out against a predominant paradigm.  Who the heck would benefit from proving that modern running shoe design is overrated?  That Emperor's New Shoes start-up?

As for scientific studies, the problem with "non-scientific studies" is that they can say whatever they want. My non-scientific study of one says I have had fewer minor issues and major injuries wearing less shoe than I have had wearing more shoe. Of course, I'm willing to say that this doesn't mean much because my one major injury in 19 years running had nothing to do with the shoes I was wearing and there could be many reasons for the fewer minor issues, the shoes being one of those many. Other such "non-scientific studes" have the same problem.

The interesting thing here is that, beyond one group of anecdotal experiments or the other, we have had input from two giant luminaries in the sport, Lydiard and Bowerman, both of whom observed many, many runners and their shoes over the years and agreed that less shoe is better.

As for people rushing to become competitive runners, it's not that they aren't competitive runners. It's that novice competitive runners want to train at intermediate and advanced competitive levels. One needs to build through the levels, many skip to advanced levels of training in certain aspects (most notably speedwork) without doing the prerequisite work required to be able to withstand the stresses of that training.

Some may not even start out as recommended to be novice runners at that point, either.  Some would benefit more from taking a more patient (go figure) long-term approach that has them exclusively swimming, cycling, and walking to get weight low enough and build up a decent amount of musculoskeletal durability before throwing in the much higher impact stress of "pounding" the miles in running.  But, as observed above, there is a whole industry that profits from encouraging people to go from couch to marathon ASAP.  Not enough of those involved with the sport are willing to give more honest, thoughtful, measured advice -- by comparison, there is no money in it!

[Ryan]

The interesting thing here is that, beyond one group of anecdotal experiments or the other, we have had input from two giant luminaries in the sport, Lydiard and Bowerman, both of whom observed many, many runners and their shoes over the years and agreed that less shoe is better.

You know, I was thinking of Lydiard and Bowerman while I was out running and was debating whether I should bring up one comment from Lydiard I recall reading about. He said that modern, overbuilt shoes were largely to blame for the prevalence of certain injuries such as, if I recall correctly, achilles tendonitis, plantar fascitis, and other lower leg injuries. He said the high heel counters and abundant cushioning in modern running shoes did more to lead to these injuries than they did to prevent injuries. He said all of this somewhere around 30 years ago, in the late 70s, when heel counters were much lower and cushioning was a joke compared to today.

Of course, that wasn't based on a scientific study. Just the observations of one person. Then again, a lot of his observations have proven to be more reliable than scientific studies.

[GTF]

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/magazine/articles/2009/04/19/what_ruins_running/

[sueruns]

I don't remember my oldest brother ever complaining of an injury (he ran late '68 early '70s).  His pumas looked like slippers and after few 100+ weeks were mostly duct tape.   Never injured.....runners just got sick from high mileage and lack of proper rest and nutrition trying to put in the mileage and getting an education....you never heard about injuries

[GTF]

http://petemagill.blogspot.com/2009/04/morning-read-baby-we-were-born-to-run.html

[GTF]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p002t9pw

Former American war correspondent Christopher McDougall explains what he learned from a reclusive tribe of Mexican Indians who are among the best long distance runners in the world. His book, 'Born to Run', is published by Profile Books.

[ksrunner]

Interesting. Ever give them a try? I'd love to hear of a review if you have. If not, maybe I'll have to consider giving them a try myself and offering up a review at a later time.

Ryan,

Awhile back while I was injured, I experimented with barefoot running a bit and with the classic model of Fivefingers. I think that I was struggling with a knee issue at the time. A friend at work was starting to run barefoot. At the time, I was running to and from work, most days, so I started taking off my shoes for the last half mile or so into work. The asphalt was very rough and my feet were raw, but the knee issues that I felt while running with shoes totally went away. The five fingers were nice. I had some chafing on my toes that would probably have led to blisters, so I stopped that experiment.

At some point, that knee problem stopped troubling me, and so long as I have been able to run as much as I am inclined to run, there hasn't been much impetus to try them again.

Since that time, I have purchased a pair of Injinji (http://www.injinji.com/) socks which I think would help to address the chafing issues that I mentioned. I have not yet tried running in the Fivefingers while wearing the Injinji socks though I have been thinking of it more frequently lately. Between reading things recently about less shoe being better and experiencing a minor foot issue lately, I think that the time is ripe to have another try with the Fivefingers.

I can let you know how it goes if you'd like.

Steve

[GTF]

I cannot vouch at all for the source, but here is some input on VFF use, for whatever it may be worth:
http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2009/05/07/vibram-five-fingers-shoes/

[GTF]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p002t9pw

Former American war correspondent Christopher McDougall explains what he learned from a reclusive tribe of Mexican Indians who are among the best long distance runners in the world. His book, 'Born to Run', is published by Profile Books.

More regarding the above: http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2009/may/12/in-search-of-the-true-identity-of-caballo-blanco/

[GTF]

And more from McDougall:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1170253/The-painful-truth-trainers-Are-expensive-running-shoes-waste-money.html

[GTF]

Another article (with video):
http://www.popsci.com/entertainment-amp-gaming/article/2009-05/running-barefoot?page=

[ksrunner]

Hello,

I pulled out the Vibram Fivefingers again this morning. I last tried running in them a couple of years ago and then shelved them after I had problems with blisters. This time, I wore a pair of Injinji socks with them. I own the Classic model as that was the only model available when I bought them.

I've been thinking about trying them for a few weeks. I even went so far as to pack them in the van so that I could pull them out and go for a short run after I went for my real run in my regular shoes, but I have been in a hurry after work so, I hadn't run in them yet. For the past couple of days, I've not been feeling well and I didn't run at all yesterday. I still am not 100%, but I felt much better this morning, so I took our dog for a short 1.5 mile run and then returned to drop her off. My wife has been trying to get me to run with Yogi for over a year and I recently relented. I've found that about 1.5 is all that she can handle right now before she either gets tired or bored. Shortly before I got back home, I felt a pain in my ankle and another nagging pain that I have been feeling in the ball of my foot which is why I had begun thinking about the Fivefingers shoes again.

So, after I dropped of Yogi, I went and got the Fivefingers out of the van and set off. I live in the country with a gravel driveway and gravel roads. The only reason that I considered running in these shoes today is because it has been awhile since our roads were maintained and they are relatively smooth from cars driving over them. Still, there are some rough places. Our driveway is rougher than the roads, so I walked down the drive. There was one other part that I walked on due to roughness which was a short steep incline near the next intersection. I went about 4.5 miles this morning in the Fivefingers. (That's a bit far for day 1 of an experiment, but it felt very good for about four miles and the last 1/4 mile wasn't bad.)

The Injinji socks made a big difference. I have a narrow foot and my foot did not slide as much inside the shoe as I recall that it did the last time that I ran in them. They also added a small amount of cushioning which was probably useful where I was running -- since you can feel even small stones in these shoes. I did step on a few stones that made me jerk my foot up off of the ground really quickly, but overall, it was pretty uneventful. I ran an out and back course -- 1/4 mile from my house to the corner and then two miles south from the corner. The first mile south was a bit rougher than the other parts and it was harder to see stones as this surface was treated with oil last year for dust prevention and is darker with stones of varying color. The other parts were just the light gray gravel road and relatively smooth and easy to see the stones. The second mile south was very smooth and pleasant. After I turned around and was nearing the corner before I turned onto my road, my feet began to feel a little tender. This was the roughest part that I ran on as I'd indicated before. When I turned back onto the road that I live on, it wasn't so bad.

Afterward, my foot may be slightly bruised, but nothing deep. When I first moved here, I got a couple of nasty stone bruises while wearing some Mizuno Wave Runners. I currently wear some Mizuno Wave Riders with no problems and I have not had any serious stone bruises for about four years, so I think that my foot has adapted somewhat to running on gravel already. Nevertheless, I tried to steer away from the rockiest parts of the road as I knew that I couldn't take a direct hit on a large stone.

I am a midfoot striker. I think that a heel striker might have problems adjusting to running in these. I was striking midfoot in the Fivefingers and sometimes my forefoot hit slightly before my rear foot.

I am definitely encouraged and will continue the experiment -- though I think that I will run in town on the smooth, paved running trail next time -- or limit the Fivefingers to the shorter run with Yogi -- our dog.

I'll probably give another update in a few weeks.

Steve

[Ryan]

Steve, interesting report. I think there's something to the idea of the feet toughening up over time like you had previously found to happen with the Wave Runners and you will hopefully find to happen with the Five Fingers. I also think that heel strikers would be better gradually transitioning to less shoe, as many others would, because they have to re-learn how to run without a pillow under their heels.

I look forward to hearing more about the experiment. I've still been too chicken to take the plunge but I do admit that, when I was at a Kohl's recently, I did check out their aqua socks and may have considered buying a pair if they had them in my size. Of course, one of the problems that one of the recent articles mentioned, of keeping your toes cramped up so they couldn't spread and grip naturally, wouldn't be solved by the aqua socks but it would be an interesting experiment for a relatively low price.

[ksrunner]

Ryan,

It would definitely be an interesting experiment. It would certainly let you know how it feels to run with just a thin piece of rubber between your foot and the road.

I looked in my running log and saw that I had last run in the Fivefingers in 2006. So, they've been on the shelf for awhile. I would probably prefer the KSO model. But, if I am going to buy another pair, I have to prove that I will really use them.

Now that a couple of days have gone buy, I find that the bruising wasn't much of an issue, but I can really feel where running in the Fivefingers brings different muscles into play. I will definitely back off on the distance for my next outing and build up more gradually from there. I am planning the next outing to be tomorrow -- though I may do a short run with the dog this evening. I already did my real run for the day.

So, Ryan, if you start a similar experiment, what would the long-term goal be.

Would you be looking to these shoes as everyday trainers? Would you race in them? Would you be at all concerned that the shoes might sometimes be a distraction from the sport?

For my part, I think that if things went well, I might make these my primary trainers -- though I might always keep a pair of other shoes for when the gravel roads are really rough. Then, if I felt that the Fivefingers were the best race-day shoe, then I would definitely race in them.

As for the distraction question, there was a guy here who ran barefoot and promoted himself shamelessly. During the time that he was promoting himself so vocally via a website and soliciting free race entries for himself, I felt like that was distracting from the sport. To the best of my knowledge, he still runs barefoot. But he has since stopped promoting himself and would no longer be a distraction. I am sure that he still gets a lot of looks and some questions if he shows up at area races.

Similarly, if I were to wear the Fivefingers shoes to a race, I am sure that I would get looks and questions about them. But, so long as I am wearing them because they are the shoes that I run best in and not the shoes that I "look" best in and so long as I am not there to promote the shoe, I don't see a problem. Once after a race, I heard a guy say, "I just couldn't let that guy in the trail running shoes beat me." I imagine the same thoughts would go through someone's head regarding any weird shoes or lack of shoes. In that regard, the Fivefingers might attract more competition which could be fun on race day.

Steve

[Ryan]

So, Ryan, if you start a similar experiment, what would the long-term goal be.

Initially, just see where I could go with them. Like you stated, if I could make them everyday trainers, I would. If they were everyday trainers, I'd have to believe they would also be my racing flats. In short, like you, they would be my racers if they seemed like the best shoe for the job.

Would you be at all concerned that the shoes might sometimes be a distraction from the sport?

Not at all. If I went this route, they wouldn't be a distraction to me. They would just be a different shoe choice from the choice that others make. If people asked me about them, I'd answer the questions but not while making a big deal out of it. If a big deal was going to be made of it, it would be by others and it would be their issue, not mine. If people didn't ask me about them, then it would be nobody's issue. They would not distract from my racing one bit. If they did from somebody else's, that would be their issue, not mine.

If I find those shoes in my size and give them a shot, I'll be sure to post updates.