Whither the Bottle?

[Ryan]

Interesting blog post from USATF COO Mike McNees.

In April, I had the pleasure of attending the heralded Penn Relays and "USA vs. the World" for the first time. Held on a perfect spring day, it was a rare event where the reality easily surpassed my expectations, and my expectations were pretty high. My most vivid memories of the day are of the blue sky, the green-and yellow-clad Jamaican fans, the outstanding performances of Team USA, the roar of the crowd ... and the water bottles.

I saw them first as well-organized armies of pallets holding stacks of shrink-wrapped cases waiting for action. Each bottle then lived a short and probably exciting (for a water bottle) life in a tub of ice on the infield, then in the hands of an athlete or official. Sadly, there were no survivors -- at the end of the meet on Saturday there was nary a full bottle to be found, only scores, even thousands of "dead soldiers" covering the infield, like the victims of some pint-sized plastic D-Day. Someone then had to pick them all up so they could be thrown away.

This, of course, is the catch. As sustainability pioneer William McDonough says, there is no such place as "away". Those pieces of shiny plastic are with us essentially forever, perhaps to be recycled into another shape, burned into carcinogenic dioxins, or broken down into smaller pieces to ultimately infiltrate our food chain (see link below).

In the track and field community, we tend to see ourselves as the more erudite, enlightened end of the sporting spectrum. Is there a "greener" city than Eugene, Oregon, and is it simply coincidence that Eugene bills itself as "Track Town"? I think not. More likely there is a shared ethos between the track and field and environmental communities. My question is, do we continue to perpetuate bottled water, this poster child of our modern, unsustainable excesses, in the name of expedience, convenience, and profit? Or do we say that no, this we can stop?

Our challenge to coaches, associations, meet organizers, including organizers of USATF championship events, and anyone else in decision-making positions, is to say no to bottled water for your track and field events. If you're not sure what the other options are, call an old-timer like me - we'll remember, and be happy to share for all of our sakes.

Some interesting food for thought there, whatever we (and RDs) will choose to do with it. Bottled water is considered the most convenient way to get fluids to the athletes but, in an environmentally conscious sport with participants who seem to be generally more environmentally conscious than the average person, is it the best way? Does it matter? Are bottles really the only practical way?

Interesting links, too. If you've never heard of the Great Pacific Garbage Patch, check that link out. It's pretty sobering and I'm sometimes amazed at how few people have heard of it.

[GTF]

Thank you for starting this topic thread, Ryan, good food for thought.

Be the change.  Take your own bottle (filled/chilled at home or at a water fountain or sink) to races, skip the post-race bottle gauntlet and head to the car to get your own.  Or get a HydraPouch, carry it in the race to use at water stations then skip said bottle buffet after the race, head to a water fountain or bathroom sink, fill it, and drink up. 

[AKTrail]

Over the past year or so, at least, there's been discussion about how to make trail races green(er) - on many counts. Here's one link http://blog.irunfar.com/2008/04/earth-week-green-races.html with many other links
but just google on "green races" for lots of others.

I think most of my races, if they have anything at the finish, usually have 5-gal jugs with paper cups or your own water bottle. Most don't provide anything during the race.

But one of our most popular local trail systems was built on landfill land (don't ask). As the landfill expands to the east, we lose trails on the west side, although there's a plan to extend the system to the east. With the few races that have used bottled water, we are highly motivated to recycle. The recycling center is not far away, almost adjacent to the landfill.

I'm in charge of a mtn bike race supporting the trail system and because of the location and date of the race, we'll be celebrating local agriculture (Alaska) by trying to use locally produced food as much as possible rather than stuff from lower 48. Eventually, we'd like to get everyone pre-registered online so there's no registration forms, but that's a way off.

Think green.

[Ryan]

Good ideas all around. A bit of food for thought that I've picked up along the way.

• The water bottle idea by GTF works well. I usually pack all my fluids and often don't take any from a race.
• Recycling, as mentioned by AKTrail: I've noticed some races beginning to offer both trash and recycling containers instead of just trash. If these aren't available and I do take something that is recyclable, I'll often take it home to recycle it instead of throwing it in the trash.
• As mentioned or at least alluded to by everyone so far, our public water systems are the best in the world. In almost all circumstances, the water is perfectly safe to drink. Use a nearby faucet or water fountain. Drink straight from it or bring your own reusable water bottle.
• Time for a question. For the RDs out there, this may be an interesting question to see responses to. If you have the choice between coolers of water and recyclable cups or bottled water, which is better? In my opinion, the coolers of water are probably better because they can be filled locally and the individual use containers (cups or bottles) can be recycled either way. The cups can also be reused as many times as necessary if a runner needs a refill. Also, with coolers of water, there's the option for the runners to use their own reusable water bottles and not even use the individual use containers.

I know I had more I was thinking of initially but it has slipped my mind. Maybe I'll add more thoughts later.

[Ed]

Hey Ryan - great topic.  As you know we used gallon jugs (recycled) and paper cups.  I am wondering if we can get some kind of paper cup that will work that can be recycled.  I do not think that the waxy paper cups can be recycled - but I'll look into that.

[GTF]

Or perhaps the corn starch cups which are compostable?  Or reusable cups if willing to wash and store them between uses.

[Ed]

Washable is no good - would you trust them?  I like the idea of the corn starch ones as long as they will hold water for at least an hour without melting.  I'll check them out - right now.

[GTF]

Well yes, it is not tricky to clean and disinfect plastic or metal cups.  I have a corn starch cup that I still use 3+ years after I got it.

[Ed]

While it may not be tricky or difficult to wash a plastic or metal cup - several hundred of them is a bit different.  Not letting them dry completely before packing for storage can cause issues - it could take a lot of time to wash, disinfect and dry several hundred cups.  You also have to consider the impact of the water, detergent and disinfectant usage over the years.

[Ryan]

I would say it is a little impractical to use hundreds of reusable cups. Not just the chore of cleaning and storing them all but also, no matter how carefully you complete the cleaning task, how many people are going to trust that they have been adequately cleaned?

Something disposable does make sense. It would just be nice to see something recyclable or compostable being used at more events so they can be saved from going into the waste stream.

[GTF]

You people act like you do not eat out at restaurants or never ate a school lunch or that water is not involved in the manufacture of cups.  It is not that tough to get plastic or metal cups (yes, hundreds) adequately clean and sanitized, it gets done every single school day of the year in your town.  Yes, to the tune of hundreds of them.  For 100-400 I could get it done at home in a single day, with little interruption to my schedule and using less energy and water and giving off less pollution than is required for the manufacture the same amount of single-use cups.  I might even be able to talk to the school district or a restaurant owner and negotiate the use of a commercial dishwasher (pitch it as benefiting the race which benefits a cause and/or the community) during non-school/non-business hours to get it done even more efficiently.  What might be given up in time would be recouped in a lower expense for the race in not needing to buy that amount of single-use cups every single year.  What is coming across is that you just do not want to do it that way, which is fine as an individual choice just do not blow the scope of what it truly requires out of both proportion and perspective in order to get around that. 

Anyway, compostable would seem to be the choice of single-use cup that would come with the lowest overall energy requirement and carbon footprint, though there are typically associated issues with commodity crop opportunity cost as with ethanol and the like.

[Ryan]

I think the issue would as much as anything be how the runners would react. I'm sure part of it might be irrational reaction but how many runners would trust that the cups have been adequately taken care of? I realize that disposable paper or plastic cups are often not handled in all that sanitary of a manner but people just trust that more than they would cups that were being reused.

I like the concept of reusing cups, which could also be used for multiple races (imagine the Badgerland Striders stocking up on such cups and using them at all Striders events - how much would that save?) but the practicality of human reaction to the cups might be a little questionable.

As for single use, compostable would seem to be the best choice. Of course, depending on several factors. In the end, though, anything seems like a step up from hundreds of cups heading to the landfill.

[GTF]

I am sure it really would be no big deal -- if they are hot and thirsty then they will use whatever cups are in front of them.  If I were hot and thirsty and all that were available were room-temperature Old Milwaukee then I would drink that, and that stuff is nasty even cold. 

[Ed]

I just have to call out the ability to wash and sanitize, dry and pack up to 400 cups "with very little interruption to your schedule."

Either your schedule is wide open or you do not wash too many dishes 

Our schools do not have cups -

Have you really loked at the cups at restaurants?  Some of them are nasty looking    some investigative reporting I have seen at both the local and national level have shown that the water (in dishwashers) in many restaurants does not reach adequate temperature to effectively sanitize. 

I know diswashers are quicker now but back in the day when I washed dishes at restaurants it was about 5-10 minutes per rack - each rack held 25 cups.  Now assuming, you have enough racks and space to allow for complete drying - it would take two hours or so just for the washing cycle.  Now add the drive to and from the establishment, complete dry time and packing of the cups.  I see 4-5 hours of time being used for just 400 cups.

My tiny run/walk - we use about 600-700 cups.  That would effectively double the time.

What if you cannot find a local place that will allow use of their equipment?  My home does not have space to lay out 600-700 cups (in a proper manner) to adequately dry before packing.  Not too mention it would be all handwashing.

[GTF]

Then you can stick to your defeatist outlook. 
I rarely get a dirty glass/cup at a restaurant, perhaps it depends on what type of restaurants one chooses. 
I could fit at least 50 cups (likely closer to 100, depending on size) into my home dishwasher and use the short cycle and natural soap.  I could do lots of other stuff while the wash cycle is going each time, but perhaps some people prefer to stand around watching the dishwasher the entire time. 

[Ed]

 

[Ryan]

The stuff coming out of my dishwasher looks nasty as well, even though it's perfectly clean and sanitary. It's called hard water. That said, I don't imagine too many strangers would want to drink from my glasses that are so stained from the hard water that they look like they are frosted.

This is part of the problem I see with reusing. Yes, I could easily do 50 cups per diswasher load and go out for a run while the dishwasher is running. However, I don't think people at a race would feel comfortable using the cups when they see the hard water stains (an unidentified substance to them) on the cups.

Again, in the ideal world, I think reusable cups would be great. In a race director's real world, something that is recyclable or compostable is most likely going to be more practical, in fact not much more work than disposable cups.

[GTF]

"Nasty?"  Apparently Americans can afford to be even pickier than I had imagined.  

[Ryan]

Well, given the things people hear about on the news (referenced by Ed), I don't think it's an unnatural response to be a little concerned when you see some kind of unidentified film on something that holds food or drink.

Of course, we all know the news tends to sensationalize everything in order to get ratings but even that knowledge doesn't seem to change the reaction of a significant number of people.

[GTF]

I have clearly "missed" that reference and "news" completely! 

[rehammes]

I recall being so thirsty on a run that I scooped water out of a puddle.  I can't imagine grabbing a cup as I ran through an water-stop and even being aware that there is a hard water stain on the vessel.  They could fill it with mud and I probably wouldn't notice.   I think runners would appreciate the effort of the race director to lessen the races impact and keep entry fees low.

[Ryan]

Rob, much like you, I've taken water from some pretty crazy places. That said, I doubt we're representative of the average runner. Also, in a race like Ed's, I'd hazard a guess that most of the water was taken at the finish line, not on the course where you just grab and drink without thinking about what you're taking.

Honestly, I'm not sure how runners would react to reusable cups. That's where I see RDs being concerned. A lot of being a good RD is conveying a positive image of the race. While reusable cups could convey a positive image in terms of lessening the race's impact and keeping entry fees low, there is a potential for a negative image to form. The RD would need to consider the cost/benefit analysis on this. All I'm trying to express is that there could be an understandable concern from the RD's perspective that could make a recyclable/compostable alternative seem to carry less risk.

[Ed]

Another point - 

Don't most runners drop their cups on the ground after drinking?  Do we make the runners stand in a line to hand the cups back to volunteers in the middle of the race or do we risk a runner stepping on a metal cup on the road surface and really wiping out perhaps breaking an ankle?

GTF how would the cup collection in the middle of a race best be handled?

I have been able to get the paper cups donated so far and I can make a good shot at getting the compostable cups donated as well.

[sueruns]

I've volunteered at a triathlon that the water aid station that I was at, a sponser donated reusable water bottles.  they were filled with tap water and gatorade.  The bikers would toss their bottles into the ditch and we'd give them a new one.  Between gaps of exchanging bottles, i'd pick up some and toss them into boxes.  If they had a name written on the bottle, i tossed them into a different box so after the race if the person wanted their bottle back, they could rummage through that box.   Pretty soon, i no longer had to pick up bottles as some of the neighborhood kids were picking them up and keeping ones they liked.

for smaller scale races, I don't see why this can't happen.  people bring their own fuel or water mark their bottles, race picks them up and the people can rummage through a box for their bottles, heck you have a box a mile down the road from the aid station with a basketball hoop and encourage people to toss the bottle.  (I know i get excited when i make a water cup in the box) .

in mexico, some of the races I've done, (big ones) used water in bags, rather than cups or bottles.  You bite the plastic to open and drink.......much easier to carry an empty bag until the next aid that an empty bottle or cup and this could discourage people from tossing them anywhrere and everywhere.

[Ryan]

As far as tossing them anywhere and everywhere, I think it was Lakefront Marathon that had garbage cans placed after the aid stations. Personally, they seemed to be a little too close to the aid stations for me but this actually worked out very well. I'd think, for a relatively small event, a few boxes or bins of some kind placed after aid stations might help on that issue.

Of course, when talking about reusable cups, the problem is that it takes only one person to just drop the cup on the course and somebody goes for a ride. Also, something I didn't think of because I wouldn't be taking water on the course of a race like Ed's but I like to pinch the top of a paper cup (like the Pete Magill video recently posted by GTF) to drink on the run. I'd personally find it pretty hard to drink out of a metal or hard plastic cup on the run. Reusable bottles, though...that could make it even easier to drink on the run but, if they were fairly nice, could make it a bit challenging for the RD to get them back. I could imagine quite a few of them disappearing.

[Andrew A.]

HydraPouch, as mentioned earlier in this thread.  Perhaps even sell them at the expo or give them out instead of shirts.

[Ed]

Could you provide some links to the HydraPouch thing?  You can just send me a private message with the links.

Thanks -

[Andrew A.]

Check the second post on this thread.

The 'first cup-free road race' in the US: http://www.aclu-co.org/events/2007LR.htm

[Ed]

The issue I see with these is stopping and waiting in line to fill the thing.

[Andrew A.]

You must not have watched the videos on the site. 

[grasshopper]

Check out this article http://runningtimes.com/Print.aspx?articleID=18022

[Andrew A.]

Further proof that there are no easy answers: http://www.elephantjournal.com/2010/02/corn-cup-trojan-horse-graham-markel/
 

[Andrew A.]

http://competegreen.com/