January 10, 2005 at 1:54 pm #2124
Well two good days so far this week. Following 12 on Saturday – I still got out for 9 on Sunday and pulled off 7.5 this early AM at Bally’s on the mill. Plan on 7 tomorrow w/strides then a very easy 10, 7 w/strides, 6 and a long run of 14 for a total of 60 miles.
January 10, 2005 at 2:14 pm #17217
Steve From NJMember
Ed, just by reading what your doing it’s easy to see that what you’re missing is a routine. No clue what other priorities you have but finding a consistent time to get the work in might help you considerably. Something to think about.
January 10, 2005 at 2:39 pm #17218
That has been the problem – I am trying to solve that in the cold dark season by going to Bally’s during the week. Weekends are easier for me to get out and do what I need to do. Thanks for the thoughts.
January 10, 2005 at 10:21 pm #17219
Ed, are you jumping from 37 miles last week to 60 this week? Jumping up to 50 might even be a bit much. You need to build gradually and consistently with patience.
I know everyone is different, but Im just getting ready to crack 50 next week after building up for about 12 weeks. I am also coming back from an injury and learned in my two months off that the name of the game is patience. It doesnt come overnight, but it will come. After 12 weeks, the pace of my easy runs is becoming faster, without me pushing it. Just get consistent and let it roll 🙂
January 11, 2005 at 2:40 am #17220Run wrote:Ed, are you jumping from 37 miles last week to 60 this week?
Ed doesn’ t listen to anyone’s advice – not even his coach’s. My guess is that he’ll say he’s going to run 60, but he’ll end up with about 40.
January 11, 2005 at 1:19 pm #17221
Zeke – do you want me to drop the daily runs from 7-9 to 5 or so? I’ll do it if you want me to. But just by my getting out absolutely every day – instead or 4-5 days – my numbers will go way up. Just doing 7-9 a day = 42-54 plus a 12+ long run will net nearly 60 miles. Any way I did about 7.5 on the mill this AM at Bally’s again – I hate the 1 hour time limit.
January 11, 2005 at 1:53 pm #17222Ed 1 wrote:Zeke – do you want me to drop the daily runs from 7-9 to 5 or so? I’ll do it if you want me to. But just by my getting out absolutely every day – instead or 4-5 days – my numbers will go way up. Just doing 7-9 a day = 42-54 plus a 12+ long run will net nearly 60 miles. Any way I did about 7.5 on the mill this AM at Bally’s again – I hate the 1 hour time limit.
For one thing, you need to do a better job updating running-log.com or at least send me an email with what you did for the week. You didn’t even post your Jingle Bell race. Since that week I show that you’ve run 7, 15, 0, 37 mpw. You haven’t run more than 5 days a week since November. So why should I assume you are all the sudden going to run 7 days per week? Also, you don’t have to run 7-9 EVERYDAY. You can mix things up. There’s nothing wrong with throwing in 4 or 5 miles instead. I gave you an outline for how to build your weekly mileage up until the program starts, but obviously that’s out the window now.
Anyway, your official program was going to start next week, so I had this being a cutback week. However, since 3 or your last 4 weeks have been cutback weeks, I don’t think it really matters anymore.
January 11, 2005 at 2:55 pm #17223
As someone who has similar aspirations as Ed (to run a sub 3:00 marathon), I feel the need to chime in here whether invited or not.
I have just completed two consecutive weeks of 40 miles run for the first time since July probably. Granted, I had surgery in August, and struggled to run between 15-30 mpw from mid September until Christmas. I was looking at running a late May marathon if I could get consistent mileage in the 40 mpw range prior to my self imposed cutoff of Feb. 1 (17 weeks prior to the race). I will most likely not run this marathon, even though I could be in the shape I desire in order to re-qualify for Boston. But that’s not what drives me. I’ll wait until I’m ready.
For those that know me, this is not a real big surprise, since I’ve run 2 races since my first (and last) marathon 15 months ago. But I feel like I won’t be ready in May to give my best effort, and who wants to run 3-4 hours if they’re not ready for their best effort? I can only speak for me.
I find it incredibly hard to run 7 days a week. It’s hard on my body, it’s hard on my schedule, since I travel once a week, and it can be hard on my family life. So I run 6 days a week. I’m not real scientific about it during this base building time; I just look at the weather, figure out which way the wind will be blowing in the morning, and pick a route to run my 5-8 miles. I’m not to the point where the 10+ mile runs have come easily (if even at all), so I feel like I know where I need to focus my training on.
Why am I bringing up all of these randoms thoughts? Because after 26 years of running, the last 8 mostly serious, I’d love to achieve some goals that I feel are within me. Part of me feels like I took some steps backward in the past 12 months, and I will have to work harder to get back to where I was, much less get to the point where I will improve. Running is probably the most selfish thing I do. I believe I am a better person for it. If I never run another marathon again, or Boston, much less a sub 3:00 marathon, I think I’ll be ok. But if I were unable to not run at all anymore, then I’d have problems dealing with that.
Sooooooooo Ed, what I will say in a nice (but direct) way is this; the people that post here are very supportive, and would like nothing better than to see you grow and mature as a runner and achieve the goals that you’ve set for yourself. But you need to take a hard look at yourself and make sure that you build the proper foundation for what you’re setting out to do. Since you post very frequently, people are very aware of what you are (and aren’t) doing. You’d probaly be better off to run more a bit more consistently and post less about your trials and tribulations. Pick your training strategy and do your best to stick to it.
As I said in the beginning, that’s just one hack’s opinion… Good luck
January 11, 2005 at 4:22 pm #17224
Living in Minnesota, a lot of the talk around here lately deals with Randy Moss walking off the field 2 weeks ago and his “moon” dance last weekend. Some of the ex-players in this area are upset at his lack of respect for the game. I think that’s where I’m coming from in regards to Ed and his talk about breaking 3 hours.
I’ve been a runner for 25 years and have completed 8 marathons. It took me 7 attempts to break sub-3. I know how hard I had to work to make it happen. I think runners tend to want to help one another get faster. I don’t have a problem with someone coming in and saying I’m going to drop 35 minutes and run sub-3 a year from now. If I can help them with advice or motivation (like this post 😉 ), I’m more than happy to help. I have a problem when that person doesn’t put forth the effort needed to make it happen, yet keeps talking sub-3 this and sub-3 that.
There’s nothing wrong with running just for fitness and maybe do some racing, even run a marathon. People just need to realize that if they want to reach their “potential” they’re going to have to put in the work and make sacrifices. Life gets in the way and we all have to balance running with family, work, social activities, etc.
I just think everyone needs to be honest with themselves and what they hope to get out of the sport and our goals. Peter is a good example. Would he like to run faster? Yes. But running is more important to him than not running. My sometime-training partner is the same way. He’d rather be a decent runner for another 30 years than try to be awesome for 5 years. Me? I think I have potential for sub-2:45, however at this point in my life I’m content with chipping away at my 2:58.
January 11, 2005 at 4:59 pm #17225
As I haven’t run a marathon (yet) I feel I have no advice in that particular area, however, over last year, I did develop into a more dedicated consistent runner, so I just wanted to chime in and say how important that is in reaching your goals. I think I started last year running in the 30 mpw range(running 4 days/week), and ended the year in the 50 mpw range, running 6-7 days a week, and saw dramatic improvements in my performances. Last year alone, dropped over 5 minutes off of my 5K time, over 5 minutes off of my 10K time, and 13 minutes off of my half marathon time. I think I’m just trying to say that it’s not as important HOW MANY miles you run today so much as just going out and getting your body used to it first and building gradually. I’m not a big proponent of the fake 10% rule, but you have to try to be reasonable. But again – take that with a grain of salt since I have not run a marathon. I cannot even imagine what that is like.
January 11, 2005 at 5:00 pm #17226
“Guest” was me. 😳
January 11, 2005 at 5:41 pm #17227
Thanks for posting. I don’t think this thread is just about marathoning. It’s about running and the goals we have surrounding running.
Some people are content to run 4 times a week and get up to 30 miles. You weren’t satisified there and your times dropped as a result. At some point your times will stagnate with 50 mpw. Then you’ll have to decide if you want to work harder or if you’re happy where your at. We all face the same decisions and challenges – more or less.
January 11, 2005 at 6:11 pm #17228
Zeke, well put. You have to decide if where you already are is your true goal, or if you want more. If you want more, you run more. Actually, I was ready for a change this year, and now I have a coach. Actually, I was fortunate in that he volunteered, and I’m quite thankful as I feel I have reached the roof of my own ability to advance myself. He is already making me work harder. I don’t know what his plan is for my training, i.e., my peak mileage, but I’m interested to see the year progress. 🙂 I took a transition week after the Memphis Half (12/4), and am now back to around 50+ mpw. Who knows what it will work up to as the race season develops as he emails my schedule week by week. The only thing I am on the fence about is running a marathon. 😉
January 11, 2005 at 7:02 pm #17229
This has been the most supportive forum that I’ve been in – I was worse in the begining – as far as lack of respect for the sport and people’s knowledge about it. I am finanly getting the idea that what you guys/girls are saying will work. I just did not understand at first how some one could run nearly all of their runs at a 9:00 mm pace and yet race at a 7:30. That was until Ryan made the comment at Jingle Bell that if some one can hold a 9:00 mm pace after a long week of training – then on fresh (not tired) legs a faster pace will be easier. It clicked – what you guys are saying will indeed work. I have gotten out every day for the past 6 days – not a big deal until I do it all the time – I know that. But in my mind it is the solid start of my consistency.
I also, lack racing experience – a 5k, two 10ks, a half and one full marathon. That is not alot. I still do not fully grasp how much more effort I can put out in a race compared to a general training run. But I understand that will come this year with Zeke’s and all of you other’s guidance.
I appologize if I come across like Moss – I have posted elsewhere that I am getting a better understanding every day what effort I will need to give. Especially since the great post by Double regarding the 2 60 miles weeks immediately followed by a 39:00 10K. That put some great perspective on the situation.
So thanks to all for the gentle, delicate, in my face and all other types of info – I appreciate all of it and take no offense to anything anyone has said. All advice will eventually sink through my hard head and could help out others as well. So let’s keep this up – it is great.
StealthyCat – I am not going to say run it or not – I am just going to tell you that finishing my first (only) marathon was an unimaginable experience of joy at what I accomplished – I was elated (probably a little delerious as well 😉 )
January 11, 2005 at 8:04 pm #17230
Ed – A big part of finding consistency is realizing that you might have to do something you really don’t like to make it happen. For me it was the fact that the only way for me to get 100% of my planned runs in was to run at 4:30 am. Too many factors could take my run away from me during the day if I waited. So even though I greatly despise getting up that early, I have been running at that time for close to a year. Saccrifices. 😉 Everyone’s situation is different, but stay open to possibilities. 🙂 Also – a very wise runner once told me, don’t think about it too much, just approach it as something you do. It’s just part of your day.
On the marathon – still on the fence. 😉
January 11, 2005 at 8:36 pm #17231stealthycat wrote:Also – a very wise runner once told me, don’t think about it too much, just approach it as something you do. It’s just part of your day.
Yeah, it definitely helps if you think of it as a life style. When you get to the point were people stop asking “Did you run today?” because they know you did – then you’re getting close.
Glad to hear you’re not taking this discussion the wrong way. Some (most) times, it’s very hard to make a point through typing without making it come across the wrong way.
One more thing. No one ever said you run everyday at 9:00 pace then come race day you hope you can maintain 7:30 pace. Put your base phase in at 9:00, then once things progress you start throwing in some 7:00 tempo runs and some 7:30 marathon pace runs and some 800s in 3:15, etc. Mix it all together and on race day, you’re ready to roll to a 3:15 marathon. NOTE: I’m just throwing numbers out here for an example.
January 11, 2005 at 8:51 pm #17232
I am getting to understand so much more and will be able to calm down becuase of that. I would be amazed to hit a 3:15:00 or so in Spring and blown away to hit the 2:59:59 in Fall. Whatever the case, you have been great as a coach so far – if you can handle me you should be able to handle any one else out there. I am a very sporadic/spontaneous person. The strict schedule should keep that in check.
January 14, 2005 at 6:15 pm #17233
OK – so I am strating to listen to people & follow their advice. I made Wednesday a rest day – did a very easy/slow 7.5 miles Thursday and rested today. (I am helping my brother move all day Saturday). I will run an easy/slow 4-6 miles Saturday. My long runs are moving to Sundays and my new schedule starts this Sunday. I am excited and now very determined. This comes from listening to and following peoples’ advice – I feel better both physically & emotionally. 😀
January 16, 2005 at 3:26 pm #17234
Mon = 6 easy
Tue = 11.6 w/ 6 x 880y (2:29,31,31,26,31,32)
Wed = 5 easy
Thu = 32.0 before work
Fri = 10 easy
Sat = 12 w/ 2.0 in 11:39 (5:55,5:44)
Sun = 10 planned easy after Church
January 16, 2005 at 4:18 pm #17235
Mon = rest
Tue = 8 easy
Wed = 7 on the treadmill
Thu = 6 easy
Fri = 4.5 easy
Sat = 10 quick and frosty
Sun = 5 easy
40.5 for the week.
Double, 32 BEFORE work on Thursday?! You animal you! Still planning on the 100K in Atlanta, I’m assuming?
January 16, 2005 at 9:17 pm #17236
1/12/05 9.6 20 min. w/u; 6x2mins on 2mins off then 5mins recovery, then 8X1:00 hard/ 1 min recoveries, 20:00 w/d.
1/14/05 4.7 3X100m strides.
1/15/05 5 (ran a 5K race)
January 16, 2005 at 10:50 pm #17237
Tues- 10 w/ 5 in the middle @6;45
Wed- 5 easy
Sat- 5 easy
Sun- 17 felt good until about 2 hours after when the couch became like a magnet 😆 I was powerless to resist.
48 total, tired this week, mostly becuase my non-running life was very busy this.
January 17, 2005 at 1:28 pm #17238
S – 6 (family in town)
M – 8 AM & 5 PM
T – 6 AM w/ strides & 6 PM
W – 11
Th – 7 AM & 5 PM
F – 10 w/ 10 x 3:00 @ LT w/ 1:00 rest
S – 20 (first 14 outside, last 6 on ‘mill)
Total – 84 miles
January 17, 2005 at 2:16 pm #17239
Steve From NJMember
79 for the week. Missed my run on Friday due to feeling like dog meat. Ran a double for 18 on Saturday and 20 on Sunday including the last mile in 5:45. Ran a little vo2 earlier in the week to try and maintain the little speed I have. Feeling really good about my base right now. Can’t recall a time when my endurance has been stronger. One more week left in the first mesocycle which is a scheduled recovery week.
January 17, 2005 at 3:55 pm #17240
Mon: 6 Easy
Tue: 7 Steady
Wed: 18 Steady
Thu: 7 Tempo
Fri: 6 Easy
Sat: 13 Steady
Sun: 12 Easy
I did the long run on Wed because I knew the weather was going to get cold by the weekend. Boy was I right about that.
The past few days have all been in the low 20’s and each day the wind gets stronger. Today, it was 25-30 mph, made the wind chill a frosty 3 degrees.
This coming week is my final week of base. Next week I begin hill repeats a few times a week. For me that will mean getting on the treadmill.
I have not retreated to the mill all winter and I have run every day regardless of conditions.
January 17, 2005 at 4:52 pm #17241
Mon – Rest
Tue – 9 tempo
Wed – 14
Thur – 5 easy
Fri – 12
Sat – 5 easy
Sun – 20 on the treadmill (Ughh, wife was gone all day so I couldn’t leave the kids in the house that long.)
Total – 65 another new weekly high, next week is a recovery week.
January 17, 2005 at 11:27 pm #17242
Total Time: 9:34:43
I felt pretty good this week. This ended up being my highest mileage week ever. In 2 weeks I might break 70 (or is it this week, I need to check my training plan). Everything is holding up pretty well. I just need to be smart about my eating snacks and drinking the adult beverages.
January 17, 2005 at 11:29 pm #17243
A lot of you crank out the miles!!
January 18, 2005 at 1:07 pm #17244
S: 15 miles
M: 7 miles
T: 9 miles
W: 4 miles, short run bc I didn’t feel well
T: 10 miles
F: 8 miles
S: 10 miles
Total: 63 miles
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