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Ryan I’m in, fill it out get the info work cell 424-5829 and the Jingle bell should be a blast. PSKI
Hey Dave, I got back on line to argue with ya!! I only think Boston is a PR course if you either have sledgehammer quads like you do have, or train to pound the living hell out of yourself so you can move the last 5 miles 😉
Having saw the Lakefront in which Ryan ran I can only say, conditions were brutal for a one way course. No one predicts time there, they just survive or die. to Ryan’s credit he went for it, balls in hand and failed gloriously.
My coaching attempt really went south, Krischbaum DNF. Walz DNF, Kooch couldn’t be motivated to train through though he really tried and hit the injury bug and other bums in the road, but scrambled on his own to mop up train and run a 3:05. Cameron ran with balls in hand in those conditions, PR pace 1:29 to the half before fading to a still BQ of 3:09.
DD is a US national team rep for ULTRARUNNING. He’d figure out 26>2 in a hurricane, and even he was almost 7 minutes off PR!
Walz and Kirschbaum were kind of bit by my own mistake, you train for a certain time and want to say the hell with it, I’m running for time, what do us HACKS have to lose. Nothing but a little foolish pride.
Now it’s my turn, my last HACK at a marathon, NYC, Nov 7th. It’s always been my goal to break 2:50, fairly modest according to some of you running kings. I’m not conderned about conditions here, there’s no turning back, I know if conditions are good, I can do it, if not I will risk it all to the crash and burn trying to do it anyway. My family will still love me at the finish line. God will know I gave my best on the training I did. My friends will know I used up what I had and left it all out there.
All I do know is the last mile will be as close to death without going there that I can possibly get. Rock On. PSKI
Damn Ryan, putting the weight of the Al’s run trophy collection on the speed challenged pollock. I will need to blow out the pipes baby!! PSKI
I have been reading these posts and have to tend to agree more with ferris and danm ryan. I still use a hrm to give me feedback on where I’m at physically. Now I use it less because I’m reaching for level, I’m familiar with and have been at before. Ferris hit a good one, it’s great for long run training and LT training or tempos to keep you honest and not let you get trucking too fast, but yeah, you have to push slightly above at times to improve that’s a given. I have trained the speedwork with and without the hrm and I have to say I like it, up to the last few repeats where I generally take it off because the result is obvious if I’m hitting my goal , I’m maxing out and dying and moving it, but it’s short lived pain and agony. Racing I don’t use it simply because I’m usually pretty close because of the training feedback. It is what it is. Now, going out too fast is always going to kill a race, but sometimes you go out looking for a breakthrough and push the envelope. I try this in lead-ups at times to a marathon. But the volume of training or base usually gives me damage control. There are times that hrm is a great tool, especially in workouts. If I’m maxing on the first interval, I need to adjust ASAP or the whole workout tanks. Base I’d argue gives you more room for error, i.e. dan, Boston 2002. I went out ahead of you and DD, Stefanovic all the way to the 5k, but knew at 5 mi I had to adjust to MP to the hills. I did wobble that last mile, and I’ll alwasy wonder if a more conservative start gets me the last mile faster or by getting me there a tad slower, to I only start the wobble sooner. It’s like the lie detector test, it’s a tool, but at the end of the day you still need the confession to go with it. Thats’ how I see training with the hrm and racing, FWIW. Good post thread PSKI
DD, I’ve yet to figure out any 5k race!! I’d guess go out fast as hell and try to die as slow as possible.
Yeah, I’m somewhat disappointed in the damn weather man. Nothing but cool this summer then wham, warm and HUMID for the 20k. Knowing any time or PR was certainly out the window, I told myself to just go out and race hard and let the chips fall where they may. I’ll have to go by memory, but I should be close.
1:21.36 or Ave 6:34
Just a race of attrition. Considering I came through 10 in under 1:05 is a great sign for me as conditons were more like Cudahy and I’m 9 weeks away here. That’s good becasue that’s usually my Cudahy time in the heat enroute to 2:50. Only time will tell if I can squeeze this out again. DD is right, there was a lot of gutsy racing going on. DD failed to mention he nosed a guy at the wire by 1 second to win the age group! WALZ trucked in right behind him in well under a minute for second in his 35-39 age group, beat only by former Lakefront winner Randy Damkot. I can also say this 20k is about 4 minutes faster than last year when I was enroute to 2:57. Hate to ramble but I need some motivation myself today. Cameron, coming out with me was brave, and my hat is off to Erhardt and Kirschbaum, racing smart, laying inthe weeds and leaving me gasping for dear life. PSKI
OK jerry, what I like are two things, you ran them strong and you ran them period! The 600’s. But, I do have the program by Pfitz before me and it calls for 90 second recoveries. With our level of training I’d even concede dropping to 2:00 min recoveries if necessary, but it’s splitting hairs. Your other runs and long run looked very solid. I hated to see you miss that 7 miler at LT pace. So bring your A game tommorrow. It is going to be a warm one. PSKI
nice, recoveries probably too long, but nice, I’m feeling better now. pski
nice, recoveries probably too long, but nice, I’m feeling better now. pski
You have got to be kidding. Unreal. I didn’t feel like doing a key 7 mi tempo run, but put in the miles anyway? Youu ain’t going back to school so what’s the problem? Blowing off 600’s your going to NEED. Blowing off a whole run! Here’s a classic case of tanking when it matters most. Worry about a 20k maybe, WHY!! It doesn’t matter, but it may now. Can’t focus for more than 7 1/2 weeks?? After everything was going so well, here’s what I suspect, you started feeling like hell and very tired. It either steals your will or you fight through. You have went to your corner, your sitting on the stool and have failed to answer the bell. Your peak may very well be this weekend, so enjoy it. And for further info, you just motivated me to blow the doors off ya, despite TRAINING through. Pack a lunch Jerry. One man left doing what he has set out to do, Jamie WALZ. DD is in a league of his own, talk about a guy who ain’t afraid to TRAIN. OK I feel better now, PSKI
Cameron, pack a lunch, DD ran 11 on the track. We churned out our 6×600’s with a 3 mi wup and 5 mi cdn. Where were you??? 300 mi not properly done will leave you sucking wind Sat bud 😉
Hey Ed, I’m glad you respect opinions, and here is another. I have deducted you are between 30 and 34 years old, 35 tops. Obviously this is from your time you posted for Lakefront and the name Ed. So, here’s something to chew on. I’m currently 41 heading to 42 real quick. I began running all together at 33, 1 month short of my 34th birthday. Ferris has credentials I can only dream about. I’d listen not only to me, but to Ferris even closer. Ah, the marathon is a PATIENT man’s game, without it you will surely be swallowed whole by it’s wrath. If you want progress, at your stage I’d even depend on Heart Rate training for a year before trying to embark on the run fast race fast theory, unless as Ferris points out you are one of the few chosen to run like mad, no matter what. Good Luck, Pski
Ed1, I see your starting again, with a 3:35 marathon PR, I like the ambition but starting with a 6:30 paced 2 miler??? You want to run a 2:50 so you can break 3?? I read alot of this stuff for entertainment and I can only see humor in your plan of attack. How about starting with 8:30 to 9:00 minute miles til your putting in 50-60 a week minimum, then talk about breaking 3 and STARTING the training then to do it. You ran one marathon and have more questions than answers, you just might not know it. Respectively, PSKI
Jerry, what’s you plan for that 7 mi lt run, will you be on the track tomorrow morning. Maybe I could wake up and be a target. And remember, the 20k is just in the way of a great marathon, train through and don’t relent on your workout schedule. PSKI
Witnessed some hard work for 5:30 am. Hell the 3 mi warm up hit 7:00 min pace. DD 55:06, Walz 55:57. Untapered and rockin. They were together for 10K at 37:00. Great run. Up next 18 tomorrow morning. Unreal. PSKI